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(@rowsella)
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I belong to a social networking site called Quora. One question caught my attention. It asked as a liberal, is there any positive thing Trump has done. This answer really made me think. It is a good example of American consciousness that perhaps, we don't like to look at but after reading it, makes me understand the viewpoint of us by people who are not Americans. It makes me think that perhaps Trump is our Hegelian karma. Here it is:

 
Brittany-Marie Aarons
 
 

 


   
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(@codyroo)
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Morning Face or Mourning Face?  Both have irony.


   
(@maria-d-white)
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I don't see it quite that way. I think Obama is who America wants to be in a good day. And Trump is who America wants to be on a bad day. After all, most Americans are definitely not crass rich white men. The same way that some people, on a bad day, honestly want to commit suicide, the average American, on a bad day, honestly wants to be a crass rich white man.

 


   
(@jeanne-mayell)
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 “The average American?”   What is an average American? 

I don’t think you really mean from your heart the words I’m reading. Maybe I’m misunderstanding.

 But it seems like negative stereotyping of 300 million people. 

Rosewella, I am very sorry if you were mistreated by people when you came here. I can’t speak for whoever did that to you or anyone else.  

Maria, most Americans on a bad day want to be a crass rich white man? 

Please explain if I’m taking this all wrong. 

 


   
 lisa
(@lisa)
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Whoa. Oh my.  Everyone - take a breath.  This site is so important to those of us trying to make heads and tales of what on earth (earth!, our home) is going on.  

Our present President and his administration is what needs attention and focus.  

I check this site every day.  Every day. Jean, it’s a fabulous service.  Time consuming and full of love.  How else could you spend so much time and effort taking care of it.  And us.  

The psychic energy of this group is so helpful to me as I think ‘Whaaat???’, most days.  

It’s a big country.  It’s a complicated country.  It’s a multicultural country.  Its an ethnic country. It’s a WASP country.  

Please.  Read Ken Wilber, ‘Trump and a Post Truth World: An Evolutionary Self-Correction”.

Finger pointing will stop after reading his analysis.  It’s stunning and so clear.   The entire world is experiencing this correction.  Trump is simply playing a role.  

And making some of us very anxious.  

Please return to amazing predictions and, to the best of every one’s ability, leave personal opinions outside the door.  

I used to work on post surgical patients in a local hospital.  A tough  love mentor said, ‘Keep your personal stuff outside the door.  The patient is vulnerable and can’t cope with it.’

The Patient - The World - is vulnerable and can’t cope with personal stuff.  We need your best face forward.  

Please.  

And Thank You.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


   
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(@lovendures)
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One positive thing Trump has done?  

I can only speak from personal reflection.

Trump has provided me the opportunity to get more involved in my community, fight for my beliefs and for the betterment of my city, state and neighborhood. He is the reason I no longer take my rights as an American citizen for granted.  Since he has become president, I am compelled to act with more love and greater kindness.  He has made me realize that any nation, even the U.S., is just one leader away from becoming a "Nazi Germany" and that if I don't stand up for my neighbors, who will?  Trump has broken the lens filter and allowed me the opportunity to see the world with more clarity, the good, the bad and the ugly.  I would say he has encouraged me to become a more an ACTIVE activist and move a bit out of my comfort zone.  I ask myself "what can I do?"  more often  AND then doing something.  I am also more  aware of the privileged life I have led.  I would consider myself an average American though I am not sure what that means anymore.  Something else to re-evaluate.

I have a feeling I will learn even more before his term is over.


   
javamyworld, Baba, Jeanne Mayell and 5 people reacted
(@zoron)
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Obviously, a big ouch.  I hear you, Jeanne, Lisa, Lovendures.  I am woked up and appalled.  This is the song and these are the lyrics that play in my heart.  It's the song I played students in my black robes on the day Trump was elected.  It's the song I played when I told a young African woman in tears that she was born for this time, and I would be standing beside and behind her all the way.  It's the song I played when the young white man sitting next to her apologized for voting for Trump because he didn't know he was hurting her.  I am back the trenches, where I will rise up with all of my kids again and again and again.  We are better than this, and we are going to change our lives with our children in our loving arms.   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNKu1uNBVkU

You’re broken down and tired
Of living life on a merry-go-round
And you can’t find the fighter
But I see it in you so we gonna walk it out
And move mountains
We gonna walk it out
And move mountains

And I’ll rise up
I'll rise like the day
I’ll rise up
I'll rise unafraid
I'll rise up
And I’ll do it a thousand times again
And I’ll rise up
High like the waves
I’ll rise up
In spite of the ache
I'll rise up
And I’ll do it a thousand times again
For you
For you
For you
For you
When the silence isn’t quiet
And it feels like it’s getting hard to breathe
And I know you feel like dying
But I promise we’ll take the world to its feet
And move mountains
We gonna walk it out
And move mountains
And I’ll rise up
I'll rise like the day
I’ll rise up
I'll rise unafraid
I'll rise up
And I’ll do it a thousand times again
For you
For you
For you
For you

All we need, all we need is hope
And for that we have each other
And for that we have each other
We will rise
We will rise
We’ll rise, ohh ohhh
We’ll rise

I’ll rise up
Rise like the day
I’ll rise up
In spite of the ache
I will rise a thousands times again
And we’ll rise up
Rise like the waves
We’ll rise up
In spite of the ache
We’ll rise up
And we'll do it a thousands times again
For you ohhhh ohhh ohh ohhh ohh
For you ohhhh ohhh ohh ohhh ohh
For you ohhhh ohhh ohh ohhh ohh

 


   
BlueBelle, Jeanne Mayell, BlueBelle and 1 people reacted
(@jeanne-mayell)
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Maria I appreciate you and thank you for so many awesome posts. It is a challenge to keep it all kind and safe.   I’m sorry for the pushback but it is wrong to stereotype.  Breathing here. I think we see in others what we don’t like in ourselves.   I want to turn that around in myself. See the good. 


   
(@maria-d-white)
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Jeanne, what I meant was, it's undeniable that a lot of Americans see Trump as an attractive figure and somebody they'd like to be, because they voted for him, and they watched The Apprentice and loved it. You can't get around that. It may be a hard fact to accept, but he did get voted president. Maybe it isn't true for literally most Americans, but for sure for the 20% of Americans that voted for him, and probably for something close to half of Americans.

Anyway, thinking a bit more about this post, it raises some flags about it being potentially a psychological operation by a campaign operative on the Republican side. It isn't very normal for somebody to see a question in Quora and write on another forum, rather than replying there. Also, the main idea was something about what America really is - I always find it suspicious when somebody wants to define your identity, especially if it's to bring you down. And the whole "can you see something positive in Trump?" is the classic "re-education" question: asking captured prisoners whether they can see flaws in their own country, or something positive in the enemy's country, is how you start to "re-educate" them.

Also, I'm not sure if it has anything to do with prophecy and consciousness - did anyone think it does?

 


   
 lisa
(@lisa)
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Good point.

No.  Not at all.  Red flag.  Red flag.  It had the regulars spinning and sputtering.  Dangerous.  Whatever that was, it’s underlying intention was to blow things up.  Turn one against the other based on personal viewpoint vs. psychic information.  Things can unravel pretty quickly.  


   
 lynn
(@lynn)
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He didn't get voted in as president. The US was attacked by a hostile nation that manipulated our election. Are there extremely limited people who voted for Trump? Sure, but even as Nixon was resigning he had supporters. People voted for George Wallace, for Pat Buchanan. The US has a lot of people with authoritarian tendencies who want a strongman in charge, because they can't think for themselves. But let's please not forget that he is an illegitimate president who is in the White House as the result of a tainted election.  And his days are numbered.


   
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(@jeanne-mayell)
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PS as for the quora question—There is nothing positive to say about Donald trump. He is a modern day anti Christ. 

The only positive thing one can say on the subject is what Lovensures expressed so well — he’s the grit that makes the pearl, the crack that lets the light in. He and his associates are the darkness that makes us turn on the light.  

Comedian dave chapelle compared the blessings of the trump presidency to the good that came from the lynching of 14 year old Emmett Till back in 1956. Till’s murder shocked America and led to the Civil Rights movement.  Donald Trunps appalling reign is giving birth to  an awakened America. 

 

 

 

 


   
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(@maria-d-white)
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Lynn, Russia may have meddled in the election, but that only moved things at the margins. You can't deny that a lot of people voted for Trump. The same that a lot of people voted for Nixon. You can't deny that they are a significant fraction of the American population. You can't ignore them or wish them away. You have to figure out what you want to do about that.

 


   
(@jeanne-mayell)
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I'm glad you brought up these issues. It gives me a chance to look at the very thing I need to see in myself that will help me evolve-- the tendency to generalize about whole groups of people. 

I don't think anyone knows the reasons people voted for Trump, statistically, but we do know that there were many different reasons other than that they just loved the guy and wanted to be like him.

1. One big factor: fake news. A recent survey looked at these reasons:

  • They thought Hillary was in poor health. (not true);
  • They thought Hillary had jeopardized national security with her private email server. (not true)
  • They thought the Pope had endorsed Trump. (Not true) 
  • They thought Hillary was a crook. (Not true)  
  • They thought Trump favored the little guy and Hillary favored the rich. (opposite is true)
  • They thought Trump was going to clean up the swamp.  (not true)  
  • They thought the Democratic National Party betrayed Bernie who they felt really does stand up for the little guy so they switched parties. 
  • I have friends who voted for Trump  only because they believed in the Right-to-Life (Anti Abortion)  and that he would overturn Roe v Wade.
  • I have other friends who hated Trump but voted for him because they always vote Republican. 

Not one of the Trump supporters I know wants to be like him. (Although there are undoubtedly plenty of people among the 330 million who do love him). 

The Vote:

  • Half of Americans did not vote for Trump.  That's a fact.  63 million or 18% of Americans voted for him. And as I've said, they had many different reasons for doing so.  
  • Voter suppression and gerrymandering give Republicans a 10 point lead going into any national election.  
  • For a democrat to win, given the fake news and the voter suppression, we need to win by a landslide. 

Trump's was the smallest Inauguration attendance in decades. This is a sign that he is not popular.

When the market goes up, a lot of people give credit to the president and his party, and when they crash, they blame the president and his party. The market's been up. That doesn't mean they want to be like him.  They  just feel more secure. 

There is no average Trump supporter.  There is no average American, German, Brit, Muslim, Russian, old person, woman, man.  

At least half of this country is in pain right now.   We are occupied.  Many are scared. All need hope.  We need to join hands with each of you and each other and find a path upward.  


   
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 Lola
(@lola)
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OMG I completely misread the start of this thread! Pls ignore what I wrote, not at all what I believe.  Jeanne I sent you an email...

 


   
(@jeanne-mayell)
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Lola, I think you did not say anything hurtful.  And frankly I wish I could take a chill pill some days. I don't think anyone here meant any harm.  We are all so sensitive these days. 

If these kinds of discussions cause us to become more sensitive when we make assumptions about whole groups of people, then it's a good awareness to have.


   
(@maria-d-white)
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All good points, Jeanne. And I agree that there is no such thing as the average person. It's often difficult to find the right way of expressing thoughts about collectives of people.

Still, I think you are underestimating the number of people who still genuinely like Trump. Probably because they have an inaccurate idea of what sort of man he is, but that doesn't change the fact that they like him. I personally know two Trump supporters that have said they'd like to be like him, one male and one female. Both seem to have bought the mythology created with The Apprentice line, hook and sinker. I can't help but think this must be fairly common. I know another man, not a Trump supporter, that explained to me the admiration a lot of people feel for him in similar terms, and told me that he used to want to be like Trump himself and had bought "The Art of the Deal", and it wasn't until the campaign that he discovered he wasn't the man he thought.

The number of those people is coming down, because gradually many of them are learning that he isn't the man they thought he was. But also, I think for many of them, especially the ones that have been holding out this far, it's very difficult to accept this. Because if Trump is a crook, then it's quite possible it isn't just Trump, but most of the mythology around entrepreneurship that's often dished out may be false as well. For many people, Trump was the face of entrepreneurship. He probably never was for you. But for those that took him as a role model and were delighted when he got elected, it can be very hard. How can they decide which of the things they were told about entrepreneurship were true and which were false? What if Trump truly is the face of entrepreneurship, and it really is that ugly? It's much easier to ignore all signs that something is wrong.


   
 lynn
(@lynn)
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Russia didn't just meddle in the 2016 election, they attacked and seriously compromised it. They hacked not just the DNC server but the Clinton campaign's too. They stole her playbook, which is how they knew to focus not just on the geographic areas where she was leading but had weaknesses, but also on specific sections of the electorate (young people, African Americans). Russian bots supported and amplified the Jill Stein campaign. Not sure if you've seen the picture of Jill Stein at an event in Moscow sitting at a table with Michael Flynn and Putin. Google it if you haven't. Coincidence? The "Grow a Spine Vote Jill Stein" Facebook and Twitter campaigns were all Russian bots, focused specifically on the youth vote and encouraging them to vote "Green." And, finally, there was the money funneled through the NRA, and possible the RNC, and possibly other compromised US federal elected officials. These manipulations were powerful enough to move even some Obama voters to vote for Trump. It was way more than just meddling.

American elections are won on the margins. We're a 50/50 country that would vote more progressive if it weren't for outside forces and our own extreme right wing that rigs elections by suppressing votes through mandatory voter ID and other shenanigans. The right can't win without rigging which is why the rigging is the fight of our lives.

What do to about people who support Trump? That challenge is best addressed through the integrity of the voting system, because if the US has clean elections the saner voices have a better chance of prevailing.

I don't ignore that fact that we have plenty of people with retrograde beliefs, but, at least for the time being, we're a free country and you can' stop people from believing what they believe, even if we see if as abhorrent. But we can work for fairness in our system (through our actions and thoughts) so that those beliefs will remain in the minority and ultimately be subsumed by the greater culture.

Finally, Trump is on borrowed time. Justice will be served. We will reclaim our collective sanity and rebuild. This time will come. In the meantime we'll work, demonstrate, and sometimes disagree on the site, but it's all part of the process of living in these crazy times.

Peace. xoxo


   
Jeanne Mayell, Bee, Jeanne Mayell and 1 people reacted
(@jeanne-mayell)
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Lynn, yes.

The elections are won on the margin and the winner assumes vast power.

Once someone manages to get elected,  Russians bots, voter suppression, fake news and all — at least a ten point rigged  GOP lead—the White House assumes great power and becomes the face of our country to the world. There is little that can intervene between the president and foreign policy. With a GOP dominated congress, he gets to do what he wants. 

If by entrepreneurship, you are talking about the power of capitalism in our society, it is true that there has been a belief that free enterprise is sacrosanct. That is one driving force here that has hampered attempts to reign in polluters, among others who do harm.

But extreme capitalism is now showing how destructive it can be. And it is causing it’s own demise.  It is going to crash the economy and of course the environment and like all extreme philosophies, it will become an anachronism.  It is hurting people and it will take time before a vast majority realizes they are like froggy sitting in water that is slowly start to boil.  

The tide is turning here although there will be more tug of war, more death throes of the old system.  

The key is to watch the seeds of light sprouting below the surface.  

 During moments of meditation, we see them rising up.  We feel the light rising in ourselves - love and understanding, tolerance  and compassion rising. 

This whole thread has caused my own compassion and understanding for those who voted for trump.  That is the light we need to bring in the peace. 


   
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 lisa
(@lisa)
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Trump is a mob boss.  For a certain population inexperienced with entrepreneurship, he seems the real deal.  

The promise of America for many immigrants was the ability to start their own small business here.  Something they could not do in a former country because they were poor and unconnected to the powers that be.

The business took care of their family and gave them a freedom to do something for themselves.  Be their own boss.  Send their kids to school.  Put clothes on their back.  Food in the table.

That continues with each new wave of immigrants into this country.  Some make it, some don’t.  But they have a chance here.  

There’s nothing wrong with that. 

There is a population that has felt it’s not been heard and feel left behind.  And they have a right to feel included at the table. A man like Trump, the schoolyard bully, seems like the guy to do the job.  It’s misguided.  And it won’t help them because he doesn’t care about the little guy at all.  

Rose glasses will come off.  Eventually there will be a recession on his watch.   Many in this group will get hit in their pocketbook.  And many will be impacted by the readjustment of businesses due to the tariffs.  

And things will change.  The only constant.  Trump’s people will be unhappy with him and we know he feeds on their ‘love’.   He can’t cope when people turn against him. 

Economics.  It’s study and application.  It’s what makes the world go round.  It’s a kingmaker and a kingbreaker.  

We may not like the guy, but he’s not going anywhere until the economy starts to crumble.  Then the Mueller investigation will have impact because the Republican Party can’t defend his policies.  

Visually I see it as whirls of consciousness rising and falling, rising and falling.  Those whirls have a job to do (like get people more involved paying attention politics).  And when they’re done, they fall away.  And something else takes their place.  

 

 


   
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