[Closed] The Unraveling -- Donald Trump
The polls are notoriously corporate media-based and right wing. Trump reminds me of Caligula the Roman Emperor who threw bread to the public in the coliseum to shore up his waning popularity.
When it's all said and done, Donald Trump emerges from this with an unbelievably deplorable legacy. Historians who look back on this time period will see that Donald Trump's actions directly caused the deaths of tens of thousands of Americans who would still be alive had Trump admitted the seriousness of the pandemic from the beginning and taken appropriate action. Instead he pretended the pandemic was fake, nothing but a conspiracy by his opponents to get him out of power. The time lost was crucial. Had he acted appropriately from the beginning, doctors and hospitals would have been much better equipped to deal with the pandemic, and more could have been done sooner to limit the spread of the deadly virus.
The huge number of Republican office holders who kept protecting him will also have a very horrible legacy. Had they acted to remove him from office for reasons not related to the pandemic but highly appropriate reasons, they could have saved the lives of these same tens of thousands of Americans who are going to perish because of Donald Trump's policies.
@polarberry thanks - i didn't think it was Joe Wilson but hope springs eternal...
I should have put that it was Rick. If it was Joe Wilson I would have had to say, "And in addition to purple zebra-striped flying pigs streaming across the sky, Joe Wilson called out President Twitler for being a liar..."
He's pretty funny. I hope to read his book when the library re-opens.
@jeanne-mayell So funny because you know he wants to sign the stimulus checks that go out to people? Not sure if he realizes most of those go direct-deposit.
@polarberry. I just burst out laughing when I read your zebra response! So true!
I am hoping against all reasonable hope that this is like the ghost of Christmas future...shadows of what might come, but might not come. Right now we have some of the smartest brains and they are hammering DJT with facts, and are good at being diplomatic and properly deferential. I still trust the Governors (most anyway) will be doing what's right. Dr. Fauci is guiding the governors. I am praying somehow the daily pressers from Trump come to a screeching halt. I am asking the Universe to make this happen, even though I don't know how.
Last saw Trump saying maybe we won't open at all. We have the doctors saying this. Or something to that affect. I am certain those who have his ear are phrasing it that he will be more popular if he locks us down, at least I hope so. So I am latching on to that slight shift from him, and I also need to say this.
I have never actively hated ANYONE for any measurable time. I feel more rancor at those who are propping him up. The Scarecrow is what was on the predictions. He is so unwell, and to use him is a sin. He is a puppet of the first order.
I am praying every day for Mike Pence to get Trump removed. not just for our sakes, but for his. He is in need of treatment. I am feeling he does have the virus, because if he did, they just would say he didn't. And everything is a lie to this administration, and I have no reason to trust anything they say.
And what is with the lack of social distancing? Why does he need 15 fauning sycophants crammed together like sardines? Those doctors look SO uncomfortable, folding in on themselves. The visual aspect tells you all you need to know about this small man. As they would say in the Biz; the optics on this are TERRIBLE.
I just watched Impotus walk over the tarmac...accompanied by USAF and military personnel and stop to speak to reporters and then board Air Force One: "Pres. Trump depart for Virginia to send off a Navy hospital ship. The global number of coronavirus cases hit 600,000 overnight, just two days after the grim milestone of 500,000 was reached. The U.S. remains the global epicenter, and at least 17 states now have more than 1,000 cases, suggesting a substantial spread from the U.S. coasts. A survey of officials from over 200 U.S. cities found 85% don't have enough ventilators and 88% don't have enough protective equipment for front line workers." He had an entourage of numerous people... in close quarters.. flying in a plane - sharing the air.. planes are notorious for spreading upper respiratory illnesses... what are the odds some of those people who were and are around today.. will give him the virus. I just had the feeling this move to fly in the face of epidemiologists and insist on going there to "prove" he is " a great wartime president" will be his undoing.
@polarberry Actually Joe Wilson has called Trump out for being a liar. He ran against him in the Republican primary but dropped out. He is a NeverTrumper.
It does not matter how Trump tries to spin this. Ultimately the responsibility/blame for the deaths of so many Americans will be laid at his door no matter how many times he points his finger at the governors. His behavior during this is additionally an indictment on how unfit and incompetent he is. He does not even know what kind of tone to set and how to be decisive in fighting the virus and protecting the American people and how to transmit a conciliatory empathetic message that unifies and comforts the fears of the people. Any other person would be better at this.
Just as 9/11 was viewed a result of a major misjudgment on the part of the Bush Admin. Yes, people rallied behind him but there were so important differences. One major difference is that it happened the first year of his presidency. Another difference is that the bureaucracy between major security agencies (FBI/Justice, CIA, Immigration/INS, State) were not talking to each other. There were firewalls between their respective areas of influence. Additionally, the available communications in real time during the disaster/attack was a barrier. For much of the day, no one knew what was really going on. We were all expecting more attacks.
Unfortunately, many people are going to die. This will expose our health system for its weaknesses. For over the last 20-30 years they have been busy decreasing hospital beds, closing facilities. The message was "healthcare is moving to the community, to the home." That has left us in a RMS Titanic situation, hitting the corona iceberg with not enough lifeboats. And unfortunately for Trump, the Captain is going down with the ship.
some good news there - some hours after Gov. Whitmer's statements, he declared Michigan a disaster area and sent a huge number of supplies. She has a good working relationship with Pence, so I think he had something to do with it. https://www.mlive.com/public-interest/2020/03/trump-approves-michigan-disaster-declaration-whitmer-says-more-supplies-on-the-way-in-coronavirus-fight.html?fbclid=IwAR2e5oBwpvgRPqQGDbCnrjpp1SWJTRXRnFGkKSoMId0h5MVfrmN0kEg06gI
I did click on this site myself, on this site just now, and it seems fine.
TRUMP is criminally responsible for his Lies and response. A timeline of his own words:
Jan 20: "I know more about viruses than anyone.”
Jan 22: “We have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. It’s going to be just fine.”
Feb 2: “We pretty much shut it down coming in from China.”
Feb 24: “The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA… Stock Market starting to look very good to me!”
Feb 25: “CDC and my Administration are doing a GREAT job of handling Coronavirus.”
Feb 25: “I think that's a problem that’s going to go away… They have studied it. They know very much. In fact, we’re very close to a vaccine.”
Feb 26: “The 15 (cases in the US) within a couple of days is going to be down to close to zero.”
Feb 27: “One day it’s like a miracle, it will disappear.”
Feb 28: “We're ordering a lot of supplies. We're ordering a lot of, uh, elements that frankly we wouldn't be ordering unless it was something like this. But we're ordering a lot of different elements of medical.”
Mar 5: “The United States… has, as of now, only 129 cases… and 11 deaths. We are working very hard to keep these numbers as low as possible!”
Mar 6: “I like this stuff. I really get it. People are surprised that I understand it ... Every one of these doctors said, ‘How do you know so much about this?’ Maybe I have a natural ability. Maybe I should have done that instead of running for president.”
Mar 6: “I don't need to have the numbers double because of one ship that wasn't our fault.”
I wonder if anyone here picks up how and when he's going to be held accountable and neutered perhaps?
@jeanne-mayell I am a retired researcher who has studied polling for a few decades now. Polls, like anything else, have varying degrees of quality. And, there are pollsters who like good researchers want their data to be right so will do the best they can to be objective (in an imperfect world.) While some polls like Rasmussen and Gallup consistently lean right, not all of them do. When polls are published, I always check to see who did the poll, what groups they were polling, how well the questions were written, and, especially, how many responses were involved. If it's 500 or less, the poll will have a larger margin of error and therefore is probably just a snapshot. If the poll involved more than a 1,000 responses, it's more reliable. Without boring anyone, I'll just say that if you want to see what the quality of a poll is, go to Fivethirtyeight.com where Nate Silver has done an excellent job of rating every polling group with grades A+ to F. He also does an aggregate of all of the polls which gives him a richer base for predictions. And, for fun, Dr. Rachel Bitecofer has created a new model for forecasting elections which is making this a lot of fun. ...if you are into stuff like this.
@seeker4 Big thanks for your input, reminding people about the importance of the sample size, and for reminding us to check Nate Silver.
If the poll result differs with my own sense, I want to see the actual questions that are asked as well as the method used to choose the households they call and the regions they call. Those variables will also affect the outcome.
I've been asked questions by pollsters that boxed me into an answer I didn't really want to give. So I'm not as certain about polls when the polls differ with my own sense.
T’s favorite pollster the Rasmussen daily tracking poll has his numbers down to:
The last time his disapproval was this high was in September 2019 as the Ukraine scandal was breaking.
@lawrence Thank you for that poll. T is not going to get away with what he did:
He has done nothing right. He does not get credit for taking reluctant action because he finally realizes that he's going to be blamed for 200,000 plus deaths and the possibly worst-handled disaster of any country in this pandemic.
Andy Borowitz gets him exactly: Today's headlines: Fauci Warns Trump that if Everyone dies in the U.S. it could affect his TV ratings.
If there is good in this man, it is so tiny that I can't see any light other than a terrified infant.
Agreed. Your description of him as 'a terrified infant' is absolutely perfect.
@jeanne-mayell The most problematic polls are usually from political campaigns that are trying to collect data for a smear or right wing religious organizations. (The Moral Majority Surveys were a hoot.) I used to collect their questions for use in class as great examples of what not to do. For example, a question like "Do you think Hillary Clinton should be locked up?" OR "Do you believe someone who is born in Kenya should be allowed to be President?" Obviously, the purpose isn't a search for the truth. In my research, I once spent more than six hours writing and rewriting a question so as not to imply an answer. It takes a lot of skill. The variables you list are essential in understanding the interpretation of the outcome. Any poll that differs with your sense, raises a red flag, etc. should always be questioned. If someone was trying to box you in, that's a red flag and big NO NO right there. Or, as I'm sure you know, is from someone or organization with a self-serving agenda. PS Although it's sometimes hard to discover, political campaigns' internal polling can be very good. Sorry if I wrote too much. I love polling so can get carried away, but am aware that not everyone does.