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Peaceful Places To Relocate During Climate Change  

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(@melissah)
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10/28/2019 9:21 pm  

Watching the fires in California is a challenge for everyone. I have evacuated multiple times in some of the large fires in California. I am currently relocated in another state because I didn't want to experience it any more. I feel lucky because not everyone is able to leave even if they want to. I became so fearful I didn't want to leave my pets in my home or go too far from my house because sometimes we had no warnings. The anxiety became overwhelming and I feel for everyone going through it during these times.

I am curious to learn about future places that have some kind of positive outlook to live peacefully during the upheaval that is going to continue. I understand the coastlines everywhere are vulnerable. I am wondering if there are peaceful areas in the U.S. that people will be looking to move to for safety or some relief. 

Are there any calmer areas that may thrive during some of these changes. I understand nothing will stay the same forever, but for those of us already starting to migrate and looking to relocate it is a challenge. I am wondering if some desert areas are safe even though they are hot? Maybe as long as they are not near a forest. 

Arizona has so many Californians moving in and I am wondering if they will just have to leave there too? Some of the climate predictions on here discuss the water issues coming up in the Midwest and it seems like people could be leaving from the middle of the country as well. Are there certain areas where people form the northeast will be migrating due to increased storm activity in those areas? 

 


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(@laura-f)
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10/29/2019 12:24 am  

I think if you look through the predictions, several, including Jeanne have said that they see the Great Lakes region becoming a safe haven in future.

I plan to stay in SoCal, won't leave unless forced to.


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(@jeanne-mayell)
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10/29/2019 10:31 am  

@laura-f

I don't know about "peaceful" but I saw a vision back in 2014  that the Great Lakes will become a prized location. I posted it and a few months later I saw a posting on a geo-political site that they were recommending the Great Lakes for their business clients.

I had received in meditation  an image of the area with bright lights around it. I then thought about why this would be so.  Water will become an issue as the world heats up. The Great Lakes are the largest body of fresh water in the world.  This area is also northerly so will be survivable in terms of heat.  But no place will be a perfect escape from climate change.

Hawaii is thought to have less impact from temperature change because it is surrounded by deep water. But it has volcanos, and there will be more volcanos from climate change. 

I am staying put for now, but for years I've felt that buying some farmland in Vermont close to Lake Champlain would be the best place for my family other than being on the other side of the border. I might prefer the Canadian side since a large part of my family is Canadian and I love that country.  But I love the U.S. too.


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(@laura-f)
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10/29/2019 11:37 am  

@jeanne-mayell

I spoke to an immigration lawyer in Canada a year ago today. If you want the skinny on immigrating, let me know and I'll email you.  Spoiler alert: if you're over 55, it's unlikely, but not impossible. The only reason I chose not to pursue it is because my husband and daughter are not interested at all, and it would mean leaving them and being poor and alone, which would bar the path anyway.


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(@melissah)
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10/29/2019 1:39 pm  

Wow this is all fascinating to hear. I had not envisioned myself leaving California when I was younger because I never imagined I would see the things I've seen and I'm still just in my 30's. I had not considered places like Canada, the Great Lakes, or Vermont. They all sound like beautiful places to live. For now I am hoping to keep renting until I find a place that feels somewhat safer to stay in for a while. 


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(@saibh)
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10/29/2019 1:56 pm  

I guess we will sit tight in Minnesota.


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 PamP
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10/29/2019 4:48 pm  

@melissah

My stepson went to New Hampshire and loves it, and my stepdaughter and her husband are staying put in western New York. Both have acreage they can grow food and have some livestock. I'm tempted to stay in Boise, but lately I'm having semi-rural dreams, and where ever the place is it looks like the northeast, outside of Philadelphia. Or maybe that's just because I used to live in that region. 


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(@melissah)
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10/29/2019 5:05 pm  

Boise is a nice place and again I've heard of a lot of Californians moving there too. It's interesting seeing where people from different regions are drawn to live as the environment changes. There are many beautiful places to live but I have struggled with leaving the coast. It was difficult to let go of the people, nature, and the lifestyle. Some of the places I have visited in the inland western areas have felt like I was not in the right place. Many of the rural areas that I've visited feel very lonely as well. Especially if I have to hide who I am to fit in with the local community. It is interesting what Jeanne said about Hawaii. It is such an amazing place but it does feel like it will go undergo major changes from such intense volcanic activity underneath it. 


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(@jeanne-mayell)
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10/29/2019 5:24 pm  

@laura-f

Thanks, Laura, good advice and I hope others will be able to use it. I also spoke to an immigration lawyer right after T won the election -- actually one in Quebec and one in Ottawa.  Citizenship seems out of range for us. My father was Canadian and I have a cottage in Quebec, but the only option it seemed for over 55 year olds was to bring sizable money in and invest it in Canadian business. The amount you have to pay and the rules are different for Quebec than the rest of Canada.  Quebec is almost like a separate country and at the time, the amount of money Quebec required was more. But essentially if you are retired, the amount of money you need to bring a sizable amount of money -- there's a range but my recollection was that it was  $1.5-$2 million-- to invest in Canadian business over an above whatever you bring for your own use.

In 2003 when we were under 55, we were serious about moving to Canada when Bush went to war in Iraq and the rules were that we could immigrate to Canada and get citizenship in about four years. But we didn't and now the rules are much more difficult due to age. I don't know if I would have left my country any way, but now it is much more challenging to meet their requirements. The Burlington Vermont area is very appealing to me and it is much closer to my Quebec place.


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(@melissah)
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10/29/2019 6:17 pm  

@jeanne-mayell

Thank you Laura and Jeanne for sharing this information about Canada. I had no idea it was so expensive. I have had friends from New York recommend Vermont. I think it is a place I would really like to visit to consider with other areas I am looking into in the northwest. 


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(@jeanne-mayell)
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10/29/2019 6:31 pm  

If you move to a mountainous area, like Vermont, remember that storms can make valleys along rivers hazardous.  Since the climate has become more stormy, Vermont has had some big storms where mountain streams and river valleys were washed out and bridges, roads, and homes were washed away.  I would chose high ground or gently rolling farmland.  


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(@melissah)
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10/29/2019 7:34 pm  

@jeanne-mayell

Thanks for mentioning this. I will definitely study more information about flooding if I seriously look into Vermont for my future. I have heard so many beautiful things about it and it is high on my list of places to see!


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(@laura-f)
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10/30/2019 12:40 am  

Actually, the Canadian thing about buying your way in is a canard. I was told that each province only approves a very few applications where someone has invested in the Canadian economy, via a business.

 

OK so here's how it works, this is more for British Columbia, but should apply in Ontario as well. Quebec is a horse of a different color.

It's a point system. You get assigned points based on age, educational status, occupation, French proficiency, and/or acquisition of a job in Canada and/or enrollment in a college or grad school there.  There is a list of "needed professions". It's pretty extensive and runs the gamut from chefs to entertainers to civil engineers, techies, and even sales people.

For me and my husband, the fastest path would have been for him to get a job there, which would have been easy enough if he was in agreement, because he sells very specific intelligence software to governmental agencies, including in Ottowa.  All it takes is for the hiring company to file a form with their INS agency, and the hired person, their spouse and [minor or disabled] kids get unlimited residency. During that residency, everyone in the family can start accruing more points to apply for citizenship after 5 years (I think).

So my plan was to get my hubby to get hired in Vancouver or Ottowa, and for me to enroll in a doctoral program to get a PhD (because students also get residency and going to school there adds more points).  The issue for me would be getting admitted to a grad program at my "advanced" age. The lawyer I met with had some kind of software to calculate our points, and I don't remember the numbers, but I remember my hubby would have needed maybe 100 more points and I only needed about 50.

The big issue is that over 55, they deduct so many points for age and existing health problems that it makes it nearly impossible. They know that Americans tend to be unhealthy, and who can blame them for not wanting to have to let a bunch of aging,sick, horrible American people into their health system? Or their society?

So another avenue is this: Americans can live in Canada for a max of 6 months at a time with no visas or residency permits required. On day 1 of month 7, you have to return to the US for a couple days, then you can go back. I think you do have to buy some health insurance privately in case you need care there, but I doubt it's as expensive as down here, and it's certainly not millions. So if you own a house up there, this is a good plan to consider. You can say you're "retired" and hang out there for most of the year. You can cross back to the US somewhere isolated like VT, where it will be easier to cross back in (maybe go to that special library in VT that straddles the border!).

Also, I think psychics, mediums, etc., can be classified as "entertainers" -- I know, not ideal and kind of denigrating, but whatever works. Lastly, religious figures of any religion (priest, rabbi, monk, etc.) are also welcome as long as you can get a gig with the religion in question OR if you found your own church/temple.

 


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(@coyote)
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10/30/2019 9:41 am  

@melissah

If Vermont is on your list of potential destinations, then you may as well include Maine. There are lots of pockets throughout the state with a back-to-the-land vibe that resembles Vermont. But Maine has a few advantages:

1) It's not as mountainous, so river valley flooding from severe storms is less destructive.

2) There are lakes everywhere. Vermont is certainly not a dry state, but Maine is much more like the Canadian Shield in terms of its hydrology.

3) The wide open job market. Lots of communities in the state, especially outside the Portland area, are contending with declining populations, so they are DESPERATE for working-age people in a whole variety of fields. VT is a bit more saturated.


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(@michele-b)
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10/30/2019 10:00 am  

@laura-f

To be honest,  when you mentioned planting trees in your yard in Southern California, my first thought was "What? After visiting immigration lawyers,  checking out Canada so deeply,  considering Australia etc.. And now planting trees in a place where trees are an issue with wildfires, what is up?"So, thank you for explaining.

And I have to add, I totally understand. When the Cascadia Sub-induction Fault hits all I would want during my "right on the border of the so many miles inland map", is that I would want all my kids and grandkids to be at one of our many big family gatherings so I could yell out "I love you all so much" as my last internal if not external thought and maybe grab on to one of my grandkids to give them those last15 seconds of going from knowing it was hitting us to not knowin anything filling my and their consciousness  with all my power and might with love and comfort before things caved in or the tsunami covered us. And that's my honest truth. Sigh. 

Even though most of my extended family in in Alaska even my other side of the island rain forest childhood home in Southeast Alaska has already been classified as currently facing a drought. We have a glacier fed lake. And snow run off from on surrounding mountains on both sides and we're in a drought.

Not sure at this point there is an ideal place anywhere and peace will have to come from within. Knowing that we made our own choices, the best we could (and often financially so) and choosing  love rather than safety or a few more years of life alone.


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(@laura-f)
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10/30/2019 12:15 pm  

@michele-b-here-in-the-forum

I like your truth, and I'm in a similar space at this point. One of the reasons I chose San Diego is because I figured if the world's gonna end, I could at least spend the last few years of my life somewhere really nice. Even here, I try to convince young people to immigrate if they can. I am actually aware of about 5 young people (under 30) who have all chosen to leave, possibly permanently, to Spain, France and the UK. I know, not exactly Norway or Canada, but they seem very happy with their choices.

As for plantings, our property is on a canyon. Bit of a double edged sword in that we have to avoid erosion (not only from rain, also wind) and we are obligated by law to keep it as fire safe as we can (no brush accumulation and with drought resistant plantings).  I don't like to garden (too many allergies and back problems), so I hire help for the dirty work. And while it wouldn't exactly sustain us, the property has good edible stuff: lemon, avocado, loquat, nopales + tunas, herbs, flowers.  I get lots of bees and butterflies. We also have foxes, possums, skunks, mice, lizards. I use NO chemicals except the exterminators have to come and spray rosemary oil around the foundation of the house for the argentine ants. And once yearly orange oil for the termites. So I feel like at least I'm doing a small part. And our property is about 300 feet above sea level, so low tsunami risk (yes we checked before buying). We don't get flooded because extra water can drain into the bottom of the canyon, which develops its own river in rainy season.

And as for me, when the Big Disaster hits, whatever it is, I'm prepared to die hugging my dogs and cats, since my husband and daughter are rarely here. C'est la vie. C'est la morte.

Namasté

 


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(@michele-b)
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10/30/2019 12:42 pm  

@laura-f

Right on!

We have acreage, fruit trees, berry and grape vines, a large garden with a well for all we use it for (as long as there's power of course, same with our heat pump for a.c. in over 100 temps) a wood stove and enough firewood for years and years. We also have 7 chickens for eggs until they age out. 

In the end, it is what it is, and we are what we are. If i had more clichés,  I'd add more, hahahaha.

"C'est la vie. C'est la morte."

And Namasté to you in return.


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(@triciact)
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11/01/2019 3:14 pm  

I live in CT, but my husband and our friends keep talking about moving to NC or SC. Maybe Southport NC which is near the Ocean and 40 mins from Myrtle Beach. I have been a Northeast gal my whole life, I don't mind the cool temperatures but my husband loves the heat (UGH). I told him maybe we can have a condo up here and a small place down there - depending on money.  I just wonder what that region will be like with climate change in the next 20+ years.

(Southport is a city in Brunswick County, North Carolina, United States, near the mouth of the Cape Fear River.)


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(@penelopefp)
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11/01/2019 9:53 pm  

@jeanne-mayell

I live in northern MI a mile away from Lake Michigan. It is a beautiful area but very remote from goods and services provided in cities and essentially no mass transit. Also, the water levels are getting higher and beaches are vanishing. Many areas are flooded, including playgrounds. After living here for almost 5 years my husband and I want to sell our almost new home and move back to Bucks County, PA, where I lived for 25 years. There are environmental issues there as well but we want to live closer to amenities so we don’t have to drive everywhere. 


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(@melissah)
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11/01/2019 11:33 pm  

@coyote

Thanks for this recommendation. I like all of the points you have made for Maine. I will look into both of them as options. I am tired of evacuating and wondering where I should go or stay. I really want to live in two different types of locations now because of it! 

 

 


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